Hayley Novak (00:00:00) – So essentially, your brand consistency is ensuring that every interaction with your customer has the same feel and consistency and reinforces what your brand stands for.

Chloe Dechow (00:00:12) – Hi, I’m Chloe Dechow and with more than a decade of experience working with thought leaders, I’ve witnessed firsthand the impact of conviction combined with purpose driven entrepreneurship. This podcast shows you how to authentically bring together leadership, equity, and marketing to build your authority so that you can grow your impact and scale your business. This is a space for elevating women’s voices and redefining what it means to be a thought leader. Together, we’ll unlock the potential of our bright voices and create a ripple effect of change that resonates far beyond the realms of business. This is the Bright Voices and Business podcast. Now let’s dive into today’s episode. Welcome back to the Bright Voices in Business podcast. Today I am joined by Hayley Novak. Hayley is a fractional CMO and the owner of Fourth Wolf Consulting, a boutique consultancy where she provides marketing and design services to small businesses. Hi Hayley, thanks so much for joining.

Hayley Novak (00:01:17) – Hello. Thanks for having me.

Chloe Dechow (00:01:19) – I’m excited to bring you on to talk about brand consistency, because I know this is really your special sauce. And it’s something that when we bring the conversation of growing your business, we can get a little bit nervous about how does our brand evolve with us as our business grows. And I’ve heard from multiple people that they’ve noticed either in their own brands or they are in a service based business and they work with other brands that, as they’ve seen these brands grow, like the messaging gets diluted, the imagery gets diluted. It just kind of gets watered down because they’ve added like products or services or team members or what, like all these wonderful things that happen as your business grows. And then all of a sudden you’re like, who am I talking to? And what do I do? And there’s kind of this disconnect. And so I love to have you here to kind of help guide those who are excited for growth, but also maybe a little bit, like, nervous about what that means for their brand as it grows.

Hayley Novak (00:02:18) – Yeah, absolutely. I love it.

Chloe Dechow (00:02:20) – So I’m curious if you could talk a little bit about what brand consistency is, because my experience, even in the marketing world is that branding is like this big word, right? And it’s like, what is a brand? And so would love to, like, help the listeners understand what brand consistency actually means, so that when we dive into more of the details of this conversation, they have that kind of foundation. Yeah.

Hayley Novak (00:02:44) – So brand consistency is really the practice of always presenting your brand in a uniform manner. And that’s across all different touchpoints. So that includes both your on and offline touchpoints, your website, your social media channels. And then that’s also including all of your interactions with your customers, your tone and your messaging, and also the experience that you’re providing your audience and how you make them feel. So essentially, your brand consistency is ensuring that every interaction with your customer has the same feel and consistency and reinforces what your brand stands for.

Chloe Dechow (00:03:13) – Yeah.

Chloe Dechow (00:03:14) – So it’s really about like every single touchpoint essentially that somebody could have with your business. It sounds like it’s not just like the messaging or the look. It’s really the feeling that somebody gets when interacting with you. It really is.

Hayley Novak (00:03:26) – Yeah. So I mean, when you think about brand, you know, I think about some of the really big companies like target’s one that always seems to come to mind for me, obviously like their visual branding. We’ll get into this a little bit more of like with the details of branding, but visual branding is the most obvious one that most people think of when they think of branding. But for me, like I’m a target red card holder, I love target, and so like for me, it’s it’s the experience that I get and anytime I have an issue, it is always immediately resolved. I’ve never had a negative customer experience with them. So it’s all of those pieces much more than just, you know, the target red circle, the red cards, you know, grabbing your Starbucks when you’re walking through target.

Hayley Novak (00:04:06) – It’s about having that positive experience as a customer and always feeling like you are going to have a consistent experience with them, regardless of which store you’re in across the country.

Chloe Dechow (00:04:18) – I love that target example, because my husband and I will get into this conversation around Walmart versus target, and for him, he’s like, well, Walmart’s so much cheaper. Like, you pay more for everything you buy at target compared to, you know, like a pack of Spindrift at Walmart is, you know, going to be like $0.50 cheaper than it would be at target. And like, I will happily pay $0.50 more for the experience of shopping at target because the floors are clean and like everything’s well lit and I know where everything is and I don’t need somebody to, like, come and unlock the face wipes for me to, like, purchase something. And so it’s such a good example of that experience that your customer has when going through something. And I’m curious, this is a little bit of a. Tangent, but people pay for experiences, right? Like here’s my example of like I want to go to target and I’m happily pay a little bit more for whatever I’m buying at target than I would if I went to Walmart or somewhere else.

Chloe Dechow (00:05:23) – And so I’m also kind of hearing like this experiences feel can also be something that lends itself to the value that you’re providing.

Hayley Novak (00:05:31) – It absolutely does. Yeah. You know, like you said, people do pay for an experience. And, you know, when we’re talking about just to scale it down a little bit more, you know, we’re talking about these large companies targeted Walmart. But to scale that down a little bit to something that maybe makes a little more sense for an entrepreneur is, you know, that experience that they are going to be working with directly with you. It’s, you know, kind of the parallel there that your interactions with your customer is so important because they want to work with somebody that they know and they trust, and you maybe might not be the cheapest person out there, but what they’re looking for is value. And so when you are consistently providing that to your customers, your customers are going to come back for that value that you can provide to them. And that’s all part of your brand.

Hayley Novak (00:06:14) – Yeah.

Chloe Dechow (00:06:14) – I think we often think about branding through the lens of marketing and not necessarily customer service or the delivery of whatever we’re selling. And so I love that example of really bringing that home, not just from a big box store perspective, which of course is a really easy to relate to brand. But being able to bring that down to the small business realm and how that can look. So let’s talk about why brand consistency is important. So we now know it’s marketing, it’s customer service. It’s all these different elements really of your business. What makes brand consistency so critical for entrepreneurs to be thinking about. Yeah.

Hayley Novak (00:06:53) – So your brand consistency is really the bedrock of trust and credibility. So when your audience encounters a consistent branding across your different platforms and touchpoints, it’s helping to build a familiarity and trust with your brand. And so for entrepreneurs, especially those who are looking to establish authority and thought leadership, that consistency is really crucial because it can help to reinforce your expertise, your values and your unique selling propositions.

Hayley Novak (00:07:21) – So by doing that, you’re making yourself more memorable and trustworthy in the eyes of your audience.

Chloe Dechow (00:07:26) – Yeah, yeah. So a lot of trust. It’s funny because like almost every person I’ve interviewed, whether they’re a personal branding expert or a personal stylist or a social media person, and now the brand consistency is like, keep being consistent because that is what builds trust in the long run.

Hayley Novak (00:07:43) – It does.

Chloe Dechow (00:07:44) – Yeah, yeah. What are some maybe like challenges that people tend to have when it comes to having that brand consistency? Like where do people get kind of stuck in making that happen? If we all know it’s important, where are we getting stuck in making that happen?

Hayley Novak (00:07:58) – If you think about challenges, you know, some of the bigger challenges that the entrepreneurs and small businesses might have are kind of your lack of guidelines. So, you know, just starting really basic. You need clear guidelines of what your brand is and that that includes, you know, we talked a little bit about those visual elements, your logo, your brand colors, your fonts, any of your imagery or your icons and graphics you’re using.

Hayley Novak (00:08:21) – But then that also includes your messaging, your tone, the style that you’re using. Are you integrating humor in your in your brand, or are you a little bit more serious? You know, all of that needs to remain consistent. And in order to to make sure that you are having those consistent pieces across the board, you need to have a solid brand guideline that you can use. Even if you are just a one person shop, you should still have that guide. So you can always reference that back. You know, as you get busy, you know, things may adjust or evolve, but you always need to use that as your reference. But then also if you are looking to grow, you either bring on employees or consultants or contractors. You can use that document to share with them. So they’re not having to kind of guess on what the brand is. You hand them that and that’s your your standard guide. And they have everything that they need to understand who you are and what they need to do to do their job that you’re paying them to do while still maintaining a consistent brand.

Hayley Novak (00:09:18) – If you don’t have that, you’re going to run into challenges immediately.

Chloe Dechow (00:09:21) – Yeah, yeah, it sounds like being able to keep those guidelines in mind when you’re representing yourself, but then also when you start to outsource or hire staff is being able to give them like one central place to put all of the information that they need to know to be successful. So it sounds like maybe there’s challenges sometimes when people don’t have those guidelines in places that they haven’t stopped to think about that before they go to hire other team members to do maybe their graphic design or their messaging, or maybe even their customer service. Right. If they’re outsourcing some of those pieces, what other challenges have you kind of seen companies run into when they haven’t been thinking about brand consistency?

Hayley Novak (00:10:01) – So another one is, you know, when you’re talking about your online presence, there’s a lot of different platforms and channels, and you use a lot of different tools to create all of them. And so. Not having consistency across all those channels. That can be a challenge and understanding really how to use your brand across the different channels.

Hayley Novak (00:10:17) – So I mean, even within social media, you have Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, maybe you’re on TikTok or some of the other ones as well. Pinterest. You still want to make sure that all of those pieces are consistent and look the same. So if the user were to find you on any of those channels, they still recognize your brand. But of course, all those worlds don’t make it all that easy because they all have different sizes of graphics that they need. They all have slightly different specs. So it’s it’s a little bit of a challenge there. But what you can do to help make sure that you are remaining consistent across all those channels is again, by referencing your brand guidelines that you have. And having templates is another really big one. So whether you’re using a tool like Canva and creating graphics yourself, or you’re hiring a graphic designer, or you are a graphic designer yourself and have those skills and you’re using InDesign or your preferred platform, having templates will always make your job easier, not only for creating that consistency, but it’s also just going to save you a lot of time when you’re creating graphics also.

Hayley Novak (00:11:18) – So I always recommend using templates, making sure that you have your brand guidelines plugged into the tools that you’re using. Like to go back to Canva. They make it really easy for you to plug in all of your colors, all of your logos, any of your imagery. Just have all of that in there so you can easily pull in any of the graphics and using the right colors that you always need in the right fonts. So yeah, templates, templates, templates.

Chloe Dechow (00:11:41) – I love that instead of reinventing the wheel every time, having a couple of go to templates to work from so that you’re not in Canva all day long, which I have definitely been guilty of in the past.

Hayley Novak (00:11:54) – So yeah, I think sometimes the templates gets like a bad rap, but it doesn’t have to. I mean, like when I say templates, I don’t mean like, you know, have one that you’re using and you use the exact same graphic every single time. You know, you want to have a variety, your brand should have some character to it.

Hayley Novak (00:12:10) – You don’t want to just put out the same exact graphic every single time, but as long as you are still using those consistent graphics, you know you can vary that up and still make it look really unique and cool each time. But it still looks different from what you posted yesterday.

Chloe Dechow (00:12:25) – Yes. So some variety within the consistency is helpful. Yeah. So let’s talk about brands that maybe had a brand guideline at one point and kind of fell off the wagon of following this consistent brand. And they’ve grown and they’ve evolved. And all of a sudden they’re realizing, oh crap, we don’t know who we’re talking to, what we’re saying, what our priorities are like. What would you recommend for a company that really does needs almost like a reset? What would you recommend that they do?

Hayley Novak (00:12:58) – Yeah, that’s a great question. So I think, you know, in a case like that you need to go back to square one, because even if you did have a brand guideline that was created and you’ve evolved, but you might have in that original document might not even make sense for your business anymore.

Hayley Novak (00:13:12) – So what I’d recommend is, yeah, going back to square one, really taking a look at what your business goals are, your marketing strategy, and just really understanding, like what you are trying to accomplish and how your marketing strategies and your branding can help you achieve that. So that’s even going back to understanding your audience and understanding the the trends in the industry and making sure that that’s up to date and that even if your your audience has changed, your messaging may need to evolve then as well. So just retracing all of that back to your business goals and your strategies that you’re trying to accomplish. One thing that I usually recommend for clients too, is also taking a look at two different things. Your competitors. What are they doing? What do you like that they’re doing? What do you not like that they’re doing? And then also like those competitors that are maybe like in your realm right now and then also your dream competitors like put yourself five years from now, where do you really want to be? What are they doing really well, and how can we incorporate that into your brand?

Chloe Dechow (00:14:13) – Yes, I love that.

Chloe Dechow (00:14:14) – And one of the things that I back when I was in my agency days, I would like to help clients kind of also keep in mind is that competitors aren’t always direct competitors. Sometimes they’re perceived competitors. And so it’s really not just comparing oranges to apples in terms of like who you compete against. It’s also like where are people when somebody has a problem, where are they spending the money to solve that problem? It doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a direct competitor to you. And so I love that idea of like taking a look and being like, okay, like, let’s do a reset. Who are we actually trying to serve? What do they care about? How has that evolved? You know, since we first started out. And then when they have a problem, what are all the solutions that they might be considering so that we’re paying attention to meeting them where they are versus necessarily like enforcing that we compete with somebody that maybe they don’t even see as competitors. Right. More part of their decision making process and then also thinking about, okay, you know, if we’re growing, let’s not just focus on today in the market today, but where do we want to go in five, ten years? And who are we excited almost excited to compete against.

Chloe Dechow (00:15:26) – Right. So yeah, exactly. That idea of kind of zooming out in looking towards the future.

Hayley Novak (00:15:31) – Yeah. And then that sets you up for success when you are scaling and growing as a, as a business, then when you reach that point, you’re not scrambling to figure out what to do. You’ve already put in the legwork to understand what your brand should be when you’ve reached that level, and then you just implement it.

Chloe Dechow (00:15:48) – Yeah, versus iterating and iterating and iterating. Right? Yeah. Getting back to the diluted messaging that you that you had before for sure.

Hayley Novak (00:15:57) – But I mean, companies rebrand all the time. So it’s not something to necessarily be afraid of if you have hit a point when you’re in your business where you feel like, you know, your brand doesn’t make sense anymore and you need to rebrand, don’t be afraid to do that. That’s totally fine. Like I said, I mean, companies do that all the time, and as long as you are authentic and are true to what your business stands for, then your audience will accept that and they’ll, you know, in a short amount of time that new brand will be your brand.

Hayley Novak (00:16:29) – That’s well known.

Chloe Dechow (00:16:31) – Yeah, I love that too, because I think we can think of rebranding sometimes as like, oh, you missed the mark. Or I think there can be some like negative connotations to rebranding. And it’s actually when I’ve done rebranding for clients in the past, like it’s actually a really fun, exciting process to be able to kind of sit back, reflect and like what is new or interesting that we’re doing today or my client’s doing today as a company that they weren’t doing five, ten, 15 years ago. And so kind of debunking the fact that not all rebranding is because some sort of crisis happened or something happened that the company is trying to adjust or fix their reputation around. It’s really a almost like a recognition or listening to the market to see what’s going to be most resonant for them and their audience as they grow. Yeah. So, Haley, I know branding and design and all these kind of marketing elements can be really overwhelming for entrepreneurs as they get started. And we also, especially women entrepreneurs, have to kind of step aside from the perfection that tends to be part of our makeup, or at least a top behavior and really kind of channel into this kind of progress over perfection mentality.

Chloe Dechow (00:17:51) – And so rather than somebody waiting until they have all the pieces together for their branding, which could take a long time, what would you recommend somebody does? How should they go about getting their branding put together from a timeline perspective? Like what would you recommend somebody does?

Hayley Novak (00:18:11) – Yeah, that’s a great question. So, you know, especially for entrepreneurs who are just starting out, you don’t need to have all of those pieces put in place. So your brand really encompasses the visual identity, your messaging, your tone, that service piece, and you know, the overall experience. So, you know, when you’re thinking about launching your business, you know, I would say the most important is, you know, just having that consistency across all of your platforms. So maybe you don’t have a logo right away, or maybe you don’t have a full brand book with your full colors and all of your brand photography. You don’t have that all yet, but that doesn’t mean that you can’t launch your business. So what you really want to focus on then, is what your business stands for, your messaging, and you know the authenticity of why you are getting into business.

Hayley Novak (00:18:56) – That is what’s really going to set the tone for your business as you’re launching. And then all of those other pieces can come together later. You know, even if you are launching a business. I know a lot of entrepreneurs, they have an idea, but they’re still like working out something. So, you know, they might not have a business name right away and that’s fine. Like, don’t feel like you need to get hung up on the little details to launch your business. If you have a really great idea, especially when you’re starting, you may be starting with most of your business by referrals. And so if you are doing that, your brand is going to be that referral, your experience that you’re giving to your customers. For them to feel such a great experience that they had working with you, that they want to share that with somebody else and tell them you have to work with them, that is your brand right there. Somebody is probably not even going to notice or care that you maybe don’t even have a website yet.

Hayley Novak (00:19:48) – Or you know, you have an Instagram, but you don’t have any posts up yet. That isn’t as important as setting up all of those other pieces to create the authenticity, the mission, your values of what your business really stands for. And then once you’ve established yourself a little bit more, then you can go back and really think about what aligns with your business. As to create a visual element that supplements that, that really enhances that messaging and tone and all of the other pieces that you’ve already established, you know, and then if you want to go and hire an expensive designer to do that, that’s a great time to do that. So, you know, what I really like to stress is that you don’t have to have everything in place. Don’t feel like that. That is a huge piece that needs to bog you down before you launch.

Chloe Dechow (00:20:32) – Yeah, in fact, it might be a sneaky version of productive procrastination coming in. It’s like I got to get all the little pieces together before I can launch.

Chloe Dechow (00:20:42) – Oh, I gotta work on, you know, this lead magnet next and then start a website and do all these things. And yes, like these are all really helpful tools in the toolkit, but if we’re not careful, we can get stuck in creation mode and not in business leadership mode, so to speak. And so being a little brutally honest with yourself, if maybe you’re getting stuck in that realm. I also think you touched on a really good point, Hayley, is that hiring somebody as an investment to do branding, whether that’s messaging or the visual aspects or a combination of the two, and I know that it’s also very easy to spend a lot of money on branding. And then because entrepreneurship is a giant experiment, you might shift or pivot or change things about your business, especially in the first couple of years. And then there could be, again, like a disconnect between yourself and the business and then the branding that you originally put together. So it sounds like from your experience, it makes sense for somebody to do some of that work first, to kind of test and work within their current ecosystem or their current network, to kind of test and see what feels really good for them before they spend, you know, there’s different levels of investment, obviously, from a branding perspective.

Chloe Dechow (00:21:59) – But before they really spend on investing in the brand work through a designer, is that what you’re recommending?

Hayley Novak (00:22:05) – Yeah, absolutely. I mean, especially if when you’re when you’re launching a business, if you don’t have a big budget to spend, there’s other ways to create, you know, the visual aspects, if you do need those. Canva is a great tool that, you know there’s a free version or even the paid version is really economical to to sign up for the Pro version and have access to all of the things in there that even if you’re not a designer, they have some nice templates in there that you can put something together, that you have your graphics that you need for your social media channels, and then once you’ve established yourself a little bit more, and maybe you do have a larger budget that you want to go in and invest in hiring a designer, then you can do that. So I think, you know, it really comes back to what your business goals are and how you want to invest in your business and really what your launch plan looks like.

Hayley Novak (00:22:50) – But there’s different options, and it’s never a one size fits all for an entrepreneur.

Chloe Dechow (00:22:54) – Yeah, absolutely. I kind of feel like starting a business is a little bit like planning a wedding, in that there are so many things that you could spend money on, like when you go through wedding planning, it’s like I could get a videographer and a photographer and then this plate setting and these, you know, there’s like so many different ways to spend your wedding budget. And it’s the same way with entrepreneurship is it’s there’s all sorts of different avenues to help figure out what’s going to grow your business. And so being really strategic about how you spend that initial kind of capital or whatever you have in your budget upfront, and then as you grow your business, you can evolve your branding with you, and you’ll know more about yourself and what you like and what your audience likes and all those different pieces as well. So I love the idea of being intentional at the beginning of like, here’s what’s going to work, and it’s enough to get me started, and then I can always invest in this down the road when I feel like I have a better sense of what I’m doing and if that ever happens anyway, in entrepreneurship, but have a better sense of, you know, the direction I’m going as well.

Chloe Dechow (00:23:58) – Yeah. When somebody is ready for that, because it is an important investment. I do think the visual aspect of a brand and the messaging of a brand can be incredibly powerful tools for recognition, for loyalty, to reinforcing your message, like all those things that you mentioned, Haley, when somebody is like, okay, I’ve already kind of like cobbled together my brand, I’m ready to invest in someone to kind of really bring this to life. How should somebody go around finding the right person for them? Like, how can they find the right branding expert?

Hayley Novak (00:24:30) – That’s a great question. So I think one of the big things is you, you know, you want to work with somebody that you trust. So I, I think referrals are always a really big piece. You may want to work with somebody who, you know, who’s had a good experience with them, and then also looking at their portfolio, seeing what their work is. Does it align with what your vision is? Because like if your brand is, let’s say like really bold and bright and, you know, you want really big branding, like a lot of colors and everything, and then you find somebody who’s most of their work is very muted and very delicate, like maybe they’re probably not going to grasp your brand.

Hayley Novak (00:25:10) – And deliver what you’re looking for. So definitely shop around, look at the different portfolio, see what people have done, and and find somebody that looks like they’ve done things that are similar to what you want to do.

Chloe Dechow (00:25:23) – Yeah, that’s such a good tip. I remember on the client side, when I worked at agencies, like we didn’t do graphic design ourselves, but sometimes we would hire out to graphic designers, and it would be interesting when a client would try to like, provide feedback on something, it would be like a completely different version of graphic design than what that particular designer would do or what it would deviate from, like the norm. And so kind of keeping in mind that each graphic designer has their own style, and that translates to different brands and different ways, I think it’s easy to lose sight of, but really important to pay attention to. Yeah.

Hayley Novak (00:25:59) – And I mean, when you are shopping around, most people are not going to be offended if you go a different direction. If they ask for feedback and you tell them, like, honestly why you’re going in a different direction, because maybe your style doesn’t match what you’re looking for, they’re not going to be offended.

Hayley Novak (00:26:13) – I think they really appreciate that feedback because that helps them to understand like a little bit more about who their customer is and what they can do differently to help attract new customers. So, I mean, don’t ever feel like you’re going to offend somebody if you are shopping around and you don’t choose somebody, that happens all the time. It’s business.

Chloe Dechow (00:26:30) – Yeah. And I’m sure the designer also doesn’t want to be forced to do a version of art or work that doesn’t feel good to them either.

Hayley Novak (00:26:38) – So yeah, that’s so true. You know, in my 12 years of experience in the corporate world and then three on my own, I’ve had a handful of projects where sometimes I do feel like I’ve done projects that didn’t align with my style, and it’s challenging and not fun. Yeah, yeah. And if you’re if you’re hiring somebody and that’s the case, then everyone’s going to be disappointed in the end.

Chloe Dechow (00:27:00) – Yeah, definitely. Yeah. That’s a good tip. As we wrap up, Hayley, what are kind of the key takeaways you want listeners to walk away with today as they think about brand consistency and what they should implement? So I think when.

Hayley Novak (00:27:14) – We think about branding it really comes down to the foundational elements. Then there’s really four key pillars that encompass all things branding that I really wanted to to reiterate, and that is the visual identity. So that’s your logo, your color palette, your fonts and your images, your brand voice, your tone, the language, a style of communication, your brand values. So your brand guides your mission statement, what you stand for and your customer experience the way that your customer feels after they interact with you. All four of those are really so important for developing your brand. I think most people immediately think of the visual identity when they think of branding, but if you ignore the other three, that’s a huge part of your brand that you’re missing out on and can cause some issues with your brand. If you’re not giving attention to all four of those pieces.

Chloe Dechow (00:28:00) – Yeah, it sounds like really weaving that into all extensions of your business is really important. It sounds like it also like doing so reinforces the visual element that we spend so much time thinking about in terms of marketing.

Chloe Dechow (00:28:15) – So making sure that touching on all of those ways, do you have a couple examples of how somebody like maybe an example for each one of those categories of where somebody could remain consistent?

Hayley Novak (00:28:26) – So an example that I actually was thinking about and is one of my favorite Wisconsin brands is Culver’s. I will use them as my example. So I think if you’ve ever been to Culver’s, you know their visual identity very well. You know, they’re the blue spoons, the blue straws, the blue booths. And you know, when you when you’re thinking about their brand voice, they’re kind of a little bit out there sometimes with some of their branding on like their kids meals bags. They’re kind of a little humor. They’re very clear on their values. They support their Wisconsin farmers and quality ingredients. Those are all things of it. And then their customer experience, that’s one, you know, if you go to a Culver’s anywhere, at least in my experience, I’ve always had a positive experience. I don’t think I’ve ever encountered somebody who’s grumpy or rude working at a Culver’s.

Hayley Novak (00:29:10) – You just you have that consistent experience all across the board. And that is what really encompasses a brand like Culver’s. To have somebody choose a Culver’s over going across the street to McDonald’s where, yeah, you can probably get food a little bit cheaper, but it’s about that experience and that overall branding that you’re getting consistently at Culver’s every time you go.

Chloe Dechow (00:29:31) – When I think about Culver’s versus McDonald’s, it’s like a quality thing, right? So like they’re really leaning on that quality experience, both with the food and with the customer service and even the little kind of details that kind of, I think, get lost sometimes when we think about branding, but like the spoon or the booth, those are really great little elements that, you know, when I see a blue spoon, because I live in Wisconsin, I know it’s a Culver spoon that’s like in my drawer, right? Like a spare Culver spoon in my drawer, all those different things. So I love that example. Yeah.

Hayley Novak (00:30:03) – And, you know, if you’re putting out a certain brand online and then if you do have a storefront or interact with people in person.

Hayley Novak (00:30:10) – And that doesn’t match in person. It feels like a huge disconnect to your customers. Like if you online, you’re let’s say you’re super quirky and funny and just like a really bright and joyful brand. And then let’s say you have a storefront and you have just a grumpy person that works, and somebody comes in and has a really poor experience because that person is not upholding the brand. That’s now a huge disconnect, and it’s changed that customer’s whole experience with your brand. So, you know, just to continue to reiterate all four of those pieces, all of those elements that really encompass the brand, that are all so important for developing a strong and consistent brand.

Chloe Dechow (00:30:50) – Yeah, I love that example too. Like how many times have we found something that looked cool on Instagram? And then we went in person and it was very disappointing. Yeah. So marketing is only one aspect of running a successful business, and the delivery and the experience is just as important. And I think really at the end of the day, that’s where we create the raving fans is, you know, you don’t you don’t create it off of the marketing.

Chloe Dechow (00:31:15) – You create it off of the care that you put in to when you’ve actually made the sale. And so especially with online business, we can get really caught up in like more followers and more leads and more this and more of that and kind of lose sight of the fact that we already have an audience to nurture and care for and build relationships with. And so I think you’re really doing a great job, Haley, of speaking to the fact that there has to be that follow through across all of those touchpoints for a customer, and the impact can be incredible because Culver’s has a big fan base. And, you know, I have yet to find a Wisconsinites who will pick different not local brands over a Culver’s any day.

Hayley Novak (00:31:59) – Absolutely. Yes. Funny story on that. My son, who he’s five and every time he’s actually we’ve never taken him to McDonald’s. And every time we drive by the one in my town, he thinks it’s actually a car repair place. And I’m like, I’m going to just keep it that way.

Hayley Novak (00:32:14) – One time he’s like, next time we need to get our car repaired, let’s go to that place. I’m like, that is a McDonald’s. And I’m never going to tell you that. But it’s just it’s funny how like, you know, and then literally across the street is call versus favorite place to go ever. But, you know, it’s that even just the way that a five year old interprets the differences between the two. Yeah.

Chloe Dechow (00:32:33) – Well, and what I’m also hearing is Culver’s is catering to the parents who don’t want to go to a McDonald’s or something similar to McDonald’s.

Hayley Novak (00:32:42) – Just it’s just not my thing. But yes.

Chloe Dechow (00:32:44) – Yeah, they’re thinking about all the stakeholders in the family who gets to decide where to eat. So love it. All right, Haley. Well, thank you so much for joining me and sharing all of your good insights with my listeners. If somebody was interested in learning more about you and what you do and how you might be able to help them, where can they find you?

Hayley Novak (00:33:05) – Yeah.

Hayley Novak (00:33:06) – So as I already mentioned a little earlier, to launch a business, you don’t have to have all of your branding at 100%. And I’ve actually the perfect example of that, that the cobbler’s kids have no shoes. I am still working on getting all of my Instagram and website up and running, and I’m taking on projects only on a referral basis. Only right now. You can find me on Instagram @FourthWolfConsulting, where I will be active when I’m in a position to take on and grow more. Or you can visit me on my website, fourth Wolf Comm to sign up to be notified when I am taking on new clients. And I’m also happy to always chat through any marketing or branding questions for small business owners. So feel free to reach out to me and see how I can help. My email is Haley at fourth Wolf Comm.

Chloe Dechow (00:33:45) – Awesome! Thank you so much, Haley. We’ll be sure to leave the contact information and links in the show notes, and I highly recommend reaching out to Haley and connecting and learning more about what she does.

Chloe Dechow (00:33:58) – Thanks so much, Haley. I really appreciate it and looking forward to staying connected and following along on your journey. 

Hayley Novak (00:34:05) – Thank you so much.

Chloe Dechow (00:34:10) – Thank you for joining me today. If you enjoyed this episode, invite your entrepreneur friends to tune in. Don’t forget to connect with me on Instagram @WestHavenCoaching. I would absolutely love to hear your thoughts on today’s episode and continue the conversation with you there. And before you go, be sure to download my free guide, Five Steps to Building Your Authentic Authority, which will walk you through how to grow your thought leadership in a way that’s true to who.

Hayley Novak (00:34:37) – You are.

Chloe Dechow (00:34:38) – And what you stand for. You can find the guide at www.westhavencoaching.com/steps.

Hayley Novak (00:34:44) – Or follow.

Chloe Dechow (00:34:45) – The link in the show notes. Thanks again for tuning in. Together we are changing the faces and voices of thought leadership. Until next time, keep leading with authenticity and impact.